Malvinas War/ Guerra de Malvinas
- Tema iniciado Iconoclasta
- Fecha de inicio
Hi Jimmy , we had some doubts abut Artillery , how was it that the British Artillery was moved , how targets were chosen - Do you happen to know a Royal Artillery member that would like to come along and tell us about it ?
Thank You Regards Enrique
Spanish /Castellano : Hiola Jimmy , tenemos dudas con la Artilleria Britanica , conoces a alguien de la artilletia Britanica que quiera venir a contarnos algo acerca de como operaban , se movian , y elegian sus blancos - Gracias Enrique
Aclaro esto , lo de preguntar si hay alguien del lado britanico en artilleria es porque realmente hasta ahora lo unico que sabemos de ellos es que nos tiraban y nos pegaban , bueno seria que nos digan como se movilizaban , como elegian sus blancos - y entonces asi poder aprender algo nuevo -
Thank You Regards Enrique
Spanish /Castellano : Hiola Jimmy , tenemos dudas con la Artilleria Britanica , conoces a alguien de la artilletia Britanica que quiera venir a contarnos algo acerca de como operaban , se movian , y elegian sus blancos - Gracias Enrique
Aclaro esto , lo de preguntar si hay alguien del lado britanico en artilleria es porque realmente hasta ahora lo unico que sabemos de ellos es que nos tiraban y nos pegaban , bueno seria que nos digan como se movilizaban , como elegian sus blancos - y entonces asi poder aprender algo nuevo -
jimmytx3
British War Veteran
It helps a lot Jimmy thanks , I'm going to forward it to the other Sub - Forum so they can read it -
Thank You Jimmy - Regards Enrique
---------- Post added at 07:37 ---------- Previous post was at 07:32 ----------
Ken , where were you and your ship on may 1 st ?
Did you see the incursion with Camberra heading towards Main Fleet were Carriers were ?
Jimmy did you disembark at San Carlos ?
Thank You Jimmy - Regards Enrique
---------- Post added at 07:37 ---------- Previous post was at 07:32 ----------
Ken , where were you and your ship on may 1 st ?
Did you see the incursion with Camberra heading towards Main Fleet were Carriers were ?
Jimmy did you disembark at San Carlos ?
Interesting clues about our wounded man Jimmy... keep us in touch please.
Regards.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interesantes pistas acerca de nuestro hombre herido Jimmy, mantenénos informados.
Saludos.
Regards.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interesantes pistas acerca de nuestro hombre herido Jimmy, mantenénos informados.
Saludos.
jimmytx3
British War Veteran
Malvinas
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2463/4015480304_03900265c1_b.jpg
HI yes, landed at San Carlos, and did the full walk across to Longdon.[/QUOTE]
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2463/4015480304_03900265c1_b.jpg
Hi Jimmy
Hi Jimmy , when ever you have a chance come by this Sub Forum :
Martin Balza los duelos de Artilleria
http://www.zona-militar.com/foros/showthread.php?t=17363
Its about Artillery during the conflict -
Regards Enrique
Hi Jimmy , when ever you have a chance come by this Sub Forum :
Martin Balza los duelos de Artilleria
http://www.zona-militar.com/foros/showthread.php?t=17363
Its about Artillery during the conflict -
Regards Enrique
Griffiths911
British War Veteran
SHR Pilot Edmund Spencer
Amigos, recien llegue a Baires despues de volar el 20/10 Taipei-Hong Kong y vuelta a Taipei como tripulante. Despues me tome el vuelo TPE-FRA como pasajero a las 00 L del 21/10 llegando a Frankfurt el 21/10 a las 06:50L y conecte con Lufthansa FRA-Baires a las 10:20 L LH510 y llegue a Baires a las 19:05L.
Estoy chequeando los email y Edmund Spencer me respondio y aca les pego su relato del combate del 1ro de Mayo.
Saludos.
Dear Friends, I have just arrived to Baires after flying TPE-HKG and back as crew member. Later, I took the flight TPE-FRA as passenger departing at 00L 21 OCT arriving at 06:50 L and connecting with Lufthsansa FRA-Baires at 10:20 L LH510. I have arrived to Baires at 19:05L.
I am checking my emails and Edmund Spencer has answered me and here you have his comments about the May 1st dog fights.
Good Morning Ariel,
My apologies for taking so long to reply. I am currently on an island in the Indian Ocean and email has been quite hard to access.
The pilots involved in the action you mentioned on 1st May were Paul Barton and Steve Thomas of 801 Naval Air Squadron embarked in HMS Invincible.
The combat merge is what we would have called a classic 'Hook and Eyeball' tactic. Steve Thomas apparently had radar contact on the two approaching Mirages and therefore took tactical lead. It would have been his intention to take one of the Mirages head to head at very close range (Perona) and then turn towards the other (Cuerva). As he passed head on with Perona Paul Barton would have been hooking in on Perona and this is reflected in Perona's account of events where he was hit by a missile shortly after the merge. Steve Thomas then dived towards Cuerva who, as you quite rightly mentioned, was heading towards cloud. He fired a missile but only saw an orange flash as Cuerva disappeared into cloud. I have spoken with Steve face to face about this and he is quite certain of the explosion.
What happened next is extremely interesting and, with the help of some of the local Malvinas Island inhabitants and Pablo Calcaterra, we have been trying to piece it together. The debate is whether Cuerva was damaged or not by the missile and whether he could have reasonably expected to have carried out a landing at Stanley airfield. I have spoken to several Australian pilots who have flown the Mirage III and they say a landing on the short runway would have been extremely hazardous.
Evidence shows Cuerva flew at low level down the main street of Stanley town rocking his wings violently. Whether this was intentional or because of control problems we don't know. he was apparently leaking fluids according to another source. At some moment he ejected something from his aircraft although we don't know what. (He had already got rid of his drop tanks.) Maybe the pylons? On this cue every single gun on the ground opened up on him. He was seen to fire a prolonged burst of cannon fire (either just before or just after being shot at) and then after a brief radio call crashed south of the airfield close to the shore line. He was killed on impact.
I regret there was absolutely no way he flew out to HMS Hermes and straffed us!
I can try to put you in touch with Steve Thomas if you like although I don't know if he will reply to you.
Regards
ES
Amigos, recien llegue a Baires despues de volar el 20/10 Taipei-Hong Kong y vuelta a Taipei como tripulante. Despues me tome el vuelo TPE-FRA como pasajero a las 00 L del 21/10 llegando a Frankfurt el 21/10 a las 06:50L y conecte con Lufthansa FRA-Baires a las 10:20 L LH510 y llegue a Baires a las 19:05L.
Estoy chequeando los email y Edmund Spencer me respondio y aca les pego su relato del combate del 1ro de Mayo.
Saludos.
Dear Friends, I have just arrived to Baires after flying TPE-HKG and back as crew member. Later, I took the flight TPE-FRA as passenger departing at 00L 21 OCT arriving at 06:50 L and connecting with Lufthsansa FRA-Baires at 10:20 L LH510. I have arrived to Baires at 19:05L.
I am checking my emails and Edmund Spencer has answered me and here you have his comments about the May 1st dog fights.
Good Morning Ariel,
My apologies for taking so long to reply. I am currently on an island in the Indian Ocean and email has been quite hard to access.
The pilots involved in the action you mentioned on 1st May were Paul Barton and Steve Thomas of 801 Naval Air Squadron embarked in HMS Invincible.
The combat merge is what we would have called a classic 'Hook and Eyeball' tactic. Steve Thomas apparently had radar contact on the two approaching Mirages and therefore took tactical lead. It would have been his intention to take one of the Mirages head to head at very close range (Perona) and then turn towards the other (Cuerva). As he passed head on with Perona Paul Barton would have been hooking in on Perona and this is reflected in Perona's account of events where he was hit by a missile shortly after the merge. Steve Thomas then dived towards Cuerva who, as you quite rightly mentioned, was heading towards cloud. He fired a missile but only saw an orange flash as Cuerva disappeared into cloud. I have spoken with Steve face to face about this and he is quite certain of the explosion.
What happened next is extremely interesting and, with the help of some of the local Malvinas Island inhabitants and Pablo Calcaterra, we have been trying to piece it together. The debate is whether Cuerva was damaged or not by the missile and whether he could have reasonably expected to have carried out a landing at Stanley airfield. I have spoken to several Australian pilots who have flown the Mirage III and they say a landing on the short runway would have been extremely hazardous.
Evidence shows Cuerva flew at low level down the main street of Stanley town rocking his wings violently. Whether this was intentional or because of control problems we don't know. he was apparently leaking fluids according to another source. At some moment he ejected something from his aircraft although we don't know what. (He had already got rid of his drop tanks.) Maybe the pylons? On this cue every single gun on the ground opened up on him. He was seen to fire a prolonged burst of cannon fire (either just before or just after being shot at) and then after a brief radio call crashed south of the airfield close to the shore line. He was killed on impact.
I regret there was absolutely no way he flew out to HMS Hermes and straffed us!
I can try to put you in touch with Steve Thomas if you like although I don't know if he will reply to you.
Regards
ES
Very interesting account. What do you think the burst of cannon fire at the end signified?
I have heard the same about Cuerva firing his cannons after being hit by our AA.
Maybe, Thunder, Rey or Gerardo can give us more information about it.
Yo he escuchado lo mismo sobre Cuerva disparando sus caniones luego de ser impactado por nuestra AA.
Quizas, Thuner, Rey o Gerardo puedan darnos mas informacion sobre esto.
Ariel
Para cuando mi sección hizo fuego sobre el avión de Garcia Cuerva, no batía alas.
Volaba recto y nivelado en dirección O-E a unos 250 metros al sur de la calle principal que entraba a Puerto Argentino.-
En ese momento volaba sin observarse ninguna anomalía.
Una corta ráfaga de nuestras dos piezas de 35 mm Oerlikon que afortunadamente se trabaron alcanzaron con pocos proyectiles la parte trasera del avión.
La máquina igualmente continuó su trayectoria pero no disparó sus cañones ni bajó el tren de aterrizaje ni ninguna seña observable.
También se apreció el impacto en la parte posterior de la aeronave que estaba a no mas de 20 metros de altura y a unos 100 metros de mi posición
Luego del impacto de los proyectiles la trayectoria de la máquina se volvió mas "balistica".
En esas condiciones continuó volando unos segundos perdiéndose de vista tras unas elevaciones.
Igual estos fueron los últimos segundos de la aeronave que aparentemente se encontraba en condiciones hasta que llegó a mi posición tras un derrotero sobre los suburbios de la ciudad donde todos le dispararon.-
Lo que relatan pudo haber sucedido lejos de nuestra vista en los instantes previos.
Saludos
Translate
By the time my platoon fired on the plane Cuerva Garcia, not beating wings.
It flew straight and level at direction W-E some 250 meters south of the main street coming to Puerto Argentino .-
At that time flying without any anomalies observed.
A short burst of our two pieces of 35 mm Oerlikon, which fortunately was locked with a few shells hit the rear of the plane.
The machine also continued its path but did not fire their guns and lowered the landing gear or any observable sign.
It also assessed the impact on the rear of the aircraft was no more than 20 meters high and 100 meters from my position
After the impact of projectiles the path of the machine became more "ballistic".
Under these conditions continued to fly out of sight a few seconds after elevations.
He narrated is the last seconds of the aircraft which apparently was in a position until he came to my position after a road on the outskirts of the city where all shot .-
What other stories could have happened far from our sight in the moments before.
Regards
Volaba recto y nivelado en dirección O-E a unos 250 metros al sur de la calle principal que entraba a Puerto Argentino.-
En ese momento volaba sin observarse ninguna anomalía.
Una corta ráfaga de nuestras dos piezas de 35 mm Oerlikon que afortunadamente se trabaron alcanzaron con pocos proyectiles la parte trasera del avión.
La máquina igualmente continuó su trayectoria pero no disparó sus cañones ni bajó el tren de aterrizaje ni ninguna seña observable.
También se apreció el impacto en la parte posterior de la aeronave que estaba a no mas de 20 metros de altura y a unos 100 metros de mi posición
Luego del impacto de los proyectiles la trayectoria de la máquina se volvió mas "balistica".
En esas condiciones continuó volando unos segundos perdiéndose de vista tras unas elevaciones.
Igual estos fueron los últimos segundos de la aeronave que aparentemente se encontraba en condiciones hasta que llegó a mi posición tras un derrotero sobre los suburbios de la ciudad donde todos le dispararon.-
Lo que relatan pudo haber sucedido lejos de nuestra vista en los instantes previos.
Saludos
Translate
By the time my platoon fired on the plane Cuerva Garcia, not beating wings.
It flew straight and level at direction W-E some 250 meters south of the main street coming to Puerto Argentino .-
At that time flying without any anomalies observed.
A short burst of our two pieces of 35 mm Oerlikon, which fortunately was locked with a few shells hit the rear of the plane.
The machine also continued its path but did not fire their guns and lowered the landing gear or any observable sign.
It also assessed the impact on the rear of the aircraft was no more than 20 meters high and 100 meters from my position
After the impact of projectiles the path of the machine became more "ballistic".
Under these conditions continued to fly out of sight a few seconds after elevations.
He narrated is the last seconds of the aircraft which apparently was in a position until he came to my position after a road on the outskirts of the city where all shot .-
What other stories could have happened far from our sight in the moments before.
Regards
Griffiths911
British War Veteran
Lt Cdr R (Fred) Frederiksen 7 April 1947 - 27 September 2009
My apologies for introducing this off topic subject but reading what Edmund Spencer had to say made me think about a thread I read on another site yesterday. In it Edmund was commenting about the recent death of a fellow Malvinas veteran and Sea Harrier pilot 'Fred' Frederiksen. Some of you may find it an interesting read. Incidentally, the accident he refers to involving a young Harrier pilot (where he rips his landing off when taking off) happened on HMS Illustrious in 1985 and witnessed by me...I was steering the ship at the time of the accident.:yonofui:
21 May 1982, Lt.Cdmr. R. Fredriksen No.800 Squadron was vectored towards four Mirage Daggers. Fredriksen destroys one with a Sidewinder missile. The pilot, Lt. Luna(C-409) ejects.
Translation Ken:
Mis disculpas por la introducción de este tema off topic pero leer lo que Edmund Spencer tenía que decir me hizo pensar en un hilo que he leído en otro sitio de ayer. En ella Edmund comentaba acerca de la reciente muerte de un veterano de la guerra compañeros y Mar piloto Harrier 'Frederiksen Fred'. Algunos de ustedes pueden encontrar una interesante lectura. Por cierto, el accidente se refiere a la participación de un piloto de Harrier jóvenes (de donde arranca su aterrizaje fuera al despegar) ocurrió en el HMS Ilustre en 1985, y presenciado por mí ... yo era el gobierno del buque en el momento del accidente.:yonofui:
21 de mayo 1982, Lt.Cdmr. R. Fredriksen No.800 Squadron fue vector hacia cuatro Mirage Daggers. Fredriksen destruye con un misil Sidewinder. El piloto, el teniente Luna (C-409) expulsa.
Edmund Spencer:
I first met Fred in 1982 on the way down to the Malvinas in HMS Hermes. I was a sprog pilot with 800 NAS and all of a sudden we were joined by this incredible group of very experienced aviators of which Fred was one.
Later, when the conflict began, Fred was one of the night flying gang and we seldom saw him during the day due to the hours of night alert these guys had to do. (Actually, not quite true. He always seemed to be crashed out on the back bench of the 800 NAS ready room! He had the gift of being able to sleep in the most unusual places in the most hectic environments.) Because he couldn't partake, he very kindly offered me his CSB ration (two pints a night) whilst he was on the night flying roster! (Didn't last for too long but I think I took advantage on the evening of 24 May!)
Later it was Fred who was LSO when Dave Morgan and I returned from our action on 8 June. It was a much later and darker first duskers than originally planned and without Fred's calm guidance I am really not sure I could have pulled it off. I was absolutely shit scared with practically no fuel.
After a stint in Hong Kong as CO of HMS Beachampton I went on to be Fred's Splot on 800 NAS. I remember a number of amusing incidents (in retrospect).
One of the young pilots not maintaining the centreline on take off from the carrier quite as well as he should. He managed to part company with his port outrigger wheel assembly as it snagged the catwalk. After climbing up into the overhead he tested his landing gear and was heard to say "I am not sure if my left outrigger wheel is down?"
The reply from Flyco, "Its down mate, down here on deck!!"
The same pilot led another reprobate up to the RNEFTS up in Yorkshire to give a talk and a bit of a fly by. The "Not below 800 feet and not above 300 kts" was clearly mis-interpretted as "Not below 800 kts and not above 300 feet!"
His wingman pulled so hard to stay in formation that he succeeded in parting company with both his 180 gallon drop tanks, one of which took away half of his tail plane. Miraculously, he maintained control and got the Harrier back on the ground OK.
The same pilot 'yam singed' a pint of neat scotch on completion of a subsequent carrier work up and promptly collapsed having stopped breathing!
Incredibly, his mates noticed and he was wheeled down to sick bay where he was re-started. I remember having to interupt Fred having a bath at the time to give him the glad tidings. "Why the hell did he do that?!" was his only comment!
Fred was an incredibly experienced and wise aviator. I remember working up for air to air refuelling. Same pilot who lost is outrigger had been in the Yeovilton bar all night learning how to air to air refuel from a hairy arsed old Lightning pilot. "Its easy mate! You just eyeball the basket and f---ing put it in there!"
"And by the way, mine's another pint of CSB."
So up we went and predictably said pilot performed an amazing series of PIO's and slashes at the basket, eventually being sent home for a very spectacular 'spokes'.
Second sortie same day - same problem despite vigorous debrief! Crabs getting quite pissed off with the assault on their tanker.
I went to Fred and explained the problem and this is what he said;
"Book the tanker for tonight and we will introduce him to night tanking!"
I was horrified! How could this guy night tank if he couldn't crack it by day.
Well, those of you who have done it will know that it is not quite so easy to see the basket at night and you really have to formate on the lights on the underneath of the tanker. Amazingly this fixed the problem and this particular pilot never looked back.
Fred was a brilliant and charismatic leader and he was loved by all. His passing is incredibly sad and I sincerely hope he is properly recognized by the Royal Navy in general and the Fleet Air Arm in particular.
ES
Again, sorry for the interruption and please carry on with your interesting
thread.
Una vez más, lo siento por la interrupción y por favor continúe con su tema interesante.
Ken.
My apologies for introducing this off topic subject but reading what Edmund Spencer had to say made me think about a thread I read on another site yesterday. In it Edmund was commenting about the recent death of a fellow Malvinas veteran and Sea Harrier pilot 'Fred' Frederiksen. Some of you may find it an interesting read. Incidentally, the accident he refers to involving a young Harrier pilot (where he rips his landing off when taking off) happened on HMS Illustrious in 1985 and witnessed by me...I was steering the ship at the time of the accident.:yonofui:
21 May 1982, Lt.Cdmr. R. Fredriksen No.800 Squadron was vectored towards four Mirage Daggers. Fredriksen destroys one with a Sidewinder missile. The pilot, Lt. Luna(C-409) ejects.
Translation Ken:
Mis disculpas por la introducción de este tema off topic pero leer lo que Edmund Spencer tenía que decir me hizo pensar en un hilo que he leído en otro sitio de ayer. En ella Edmund comentaba acerca de la reciente muerte de un veterano de la guerra compañeros y Mar piloto Harrier 'Frederiksen Fred'. Algunos de ustedes pueden encontrar una interesante lectura. Por cierto, el accidente se refiere a la participación de un piloto de Harrier jóvenes (de donde arranca su aterrizaje fuera al despegar) ocurrió en el HMS Ilustre en 1985, y presenciado por mí ... yo era el gobierno del buque en el momento del accidente.:yonofui:
21 de mayo 1982, Lt.Cdmr. R. Fredriksen No.800 Squadron fue vector hacia cuatro Mirage Daggers. Fredriksen destruye con un misil Sidewinder. El piloto, el teniente Luna (C-409) expulsa.
Edmund Spencer:
I first met Fred in 1982 on the way down to the Malvinas in HMS Hermes. I was a sprog pilot with 800 NAS and all of a sudden we were joined by this incredible group of very experienced aviators of which Fred was one.
Later, when the conflict began, Fred was one of the night flying gang and we seldom saw him during the day due to the hours of night alert these guys had to do. (Actually, not quite true. He always seemed to be crashed out on the back bench of the 800 NAS ready room! He had the gift of being able to sleep in the most unusual places in the most hectic environments.) Because he couldn't partake, he very kindly offered me his CSB ration (two pints a night) whilst he was on the night flying roster! (Didn't last for too long but I think I took advantage on the evening of 24 May!)
Later it was Fred who was LSO when Dave Morgan and I returned from our action on 8 June. It was a much later and darker first duskers than originally planned and without Fred's calm guidance I am really not sure I could have pulled it off. I was absolutely shit scared with practically no fuel.
After a stint in Hong Kong as CO of HMS Beachampton I went on to be Fred's Splot on 800 NAS. I remember a number of amusing incidents (in retrospect).
One of the young pilots not maintaining the centreline on take off from the carrier quite as well as he should. He managed to part company with his port outrigger wheel assembly as it snagged the catwalk. After climbing up into the overhead he tested his landing gear and was heard to say "I am not sure if my left outrigger wheel is down?"
The reply from Flyco, "Its down mate, down here on deck!!"
The same pilot led another reprobate up to the RNEFTS up in Yorkshire to give a talk and a bit of a fly by. The "Not below 800 feet and not above 300 kts" was clearly mis-interpretted as "Not below 800 kts and not above 300 feet!"
His wingman pulled so hard to stay in formation that he succeeded in parting company with both his 180 gallon drop tanks, one of which took away half of his tail plane. Miraculously, he maintained control and got the Harrier back on the ground OK.
The same pilot 'yam singed' a pint of neat scotch on completion of a subsequent carrier work up and promptly collapsed having stopped breathing!
Incredibly, his mates noticed and he was wheeled down to sick bay where he was re-started. I remember having to interupt Fred having a bath at the time to give him the glad tidings. "Why the hell did he do that?!" was his only comment!
Fred was an incredibly experienced and wise aviator. I remember working up for air to air refuelling. Same pilot who lost is outrigger had been in the Yeovilton bar all night learning how to air to air refuel from a hairy arsed old Lightning pilot. "Its easy mate! You just eyeball the basket and f---ing put it in there!"
"And by the way, mine's another pint of CSB."
So up we went and predictably said pilot performed an amazing series of PIO's and slashes at the basket, eventually being sent home for a very spectacular 'spokes'.
Second sortie same day - same problem despite vigorous debrief! Crabs getting quite pissed off with the assault on their tanker.
I went to Fred and explained the problem and this is what he said;
"Book the tanker for tonight and we will introduce him to night tanking!"
I was horrified! How could this guy night tank if he couldn't crack it by day.
Well, those of you who have done it will know that it is not quite so easy to see the basket at night and you really have to formate on the lights on the underneath of the tanker. Amazingly this fixed the problem and this particular pilot never looked back.
Fred was a brilliant and charismatic leader and he was loved by all. His passing is incredibly sad and I sincerely hope he is properly recognized by the Royal Navy in general and the Fleet Air Arm in particular.
ES
Again, sorry for the interruption and please carry on with your interesting
thread.
Una vez más, lo siento por la interrupción y por favor continúe con su tema interesante.
Ken.
R.I.P.
Q.E.P.D.
Q.E.P.D.
jimmytx3
British War Veteran
LONGDON
Hola all,
Still looking for more information..
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2556/4057847947_c633b08be1_b.jpg
:cheers2:
Hola all,
Still looking for more information..
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2556/4057847947_c633b08be1_b.jpg
:cheers2:
Hello Jimmy, you had the news about Sergio Delgado?
Hola Jimmy, tuviste noticias acerca de Sergio Delgado ?
Hola Jimmy, tuviste noticias acerca de Sergio Delgado ?
jimmytx3
British War Veteran
photo
i have tried cecim.org.arg but nothing, you cannot fault me for trying ..
adios Jimmy:cheers2:
hola Willy, nothing, still searching, sending emails out everywhere, i read Oscar was a very popular cabo, but no one seems to be in contact with him,
i have tried cecim.org.arg but nothing, you cannot fault me for trying ..
adios Jimmy:cheers2:
Hello Jimmy, I am going to try it and soon I say to you.
Hola Jimmy, voy a intentarlo y luego te digo.
Regards
Saludos
Hola Jimmy, voy a intentarlo y luego te digo.
Regards
Saludos
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