+1
Pero no se puede negar que tener el poder de desplegar 4 TAM en pocas horas es un poder de disuación bastante alto.
Embraer - KC-390
- Tema iniciado paulo
- Fecha de inicio
+1
Pero no se puede negar que tener el poder de desplegar 4 TAM en pocas horas es un poder de disuación bastante alto.
Disuacion 4 TAM ?? puede ser, pero si a los que queres disuadir tienen RPG no se podra hacer mucho, preferible enviar Commandos
Si tuvieran al pais bien trazado por vias ferreas seria el mejor metodo para desplegar a los tanques o en su defecto una buena cantidad de camiones pesados y trailers para tanques
Si tuvieran al pais bien trazado por vias ferreas seria el mejor metodo para desplegar a los tanques o en su defecto una buena cantidad de camiones pesados y trailers para tanques
En vez de 4 TAM, mandas una compania reforzada de Infanteria Aerotransportada con medios livianos con los mismos aviones.
Y eso que soy un defensor de tener un avion capaz de cargar a los TAM...
S
SnAkE_OnE
totalmente..para que queres llevar 4 TAM? ni hablar de que tenes que mandar un quinto KC-390 con el soporte..
Que es una necesidad que deberiamos tener disponible, es verdad, pero para esas acciones rapidas yo prefiero la brigada aerotranportada con Hummers o Panhard VBL con TOW-2B1/Milan II, mas Eryx y AT-4, con Stinger II.
Una compania reforzada con esos bichos la mandas en 6 KC-390, y te paran lo que sea por una par de dias, incluso, si les mantenes la logistica y le madas chopers de apoyo. Pegar y correr, esa es la mejor accion, y si tuvieramos unos AH-1S mejorados (como los que K cancelo ya elegidos y probados), ni te digo...
Abrazo!
S
SnAkE_OnE
seguro, incluso 2 VCBR como los Norinco con ATGM's
No fue K quien cancelo los AH-1S, no se si fue Duhalde en 2002
No fue K quien cancelo los AH-1S, no se si fue Duhalde en 2002
Jorge II
Serpiente Negra.
todo muy bien, pero en lo personal estaria bueno que estén basados en cordoba asi tener menos tiempos de movilización y tambien hacer operaciones con las brigadas aerotransportada desde ahi hacia cualquier punto del pais. es decir; tener un alistamiento corto y desde ahi mandar los paracaidista a ushuaia. ahi seria interesante.
No Fede, fue K con su mascota disfrazada de JEM. Los VCBR son muy grandes y lentos para jugar al hit-and-run del qué hablo.
Abrazo. ;-)
Con los 4 TAM no estoy hablando de disuadir una divición de un ejercito enemigo.
Pero saber que se tiene esa posibilidad de desplegar tanques en retaguardia, disuade.
Pero saber que se tiene esa posibilidad de desplegar tanques en retaguardia, disuade.
vos decis que si atacan bariloche mandas un Foudre y listo?:smilielol5:
Los aviones tienen mas versatilidad.
Derruido
Colaborador
Le sacamos las torretas y los mandamos desarmados.:biggrinjester:
Salute
El Derru
PD: La pobreza tiene cara de hereje.:ack2:
Ahhh...o sea , va a mover 44 tanques (¿de ese orden tiene un grupo de tanques en Argentina o estoy equivocado?) , para defender Bariloche (o el lugar que sea) , por avión :svengo:...para mover UN tanque quizas , pero para mover una seccion completa de tanques en avión.....hay cosas mucho mejores como por ejemplo , carretera...o una combinación barco/carretera.
4 tanques serian una sección de exploración , si los envia solos no pueden hacer mucho.
Por lo demás, comparto plenamente la opinion de MarioAR
Saludos.
Repito, no me refiero a detener un ataque de una división entera, simplemente que TENER LA POSIBILIDAD es disuasivo (Por ejemplo, podríamos llevarlos a Malvinas).
El comentario de Bariloche era una ironía, solo para remarcar que el avión es más versátil, nadie discute la capacidad de carga reducida, sin dudas.
Para ser más claro voy a dar un ejemplo.
Supongamos que la FAA en 1982 tenía estos avioncitos de 29Tn de carga, en vez de llevar AML-90 podríamos llevar TAM por buque. Y luego del cierre de la vía marina por parte de los ingleses hubiéramos tenido la posibilidad de reforzar enviándolos por puente aéreo.
Ahora bien, personalmente, y es opinión mía, me parece medio nabo utilizar un viaje, rompiendo bloqueo solo para llevar un tanque cuando hay muchas cosas más necesarias, pero es indiscutible que la posibilidad esta y quizás en un supuesto 21 de mayo, la ficticia fuerza de TAM’s hubiera marcado una diferencia.
Espero haber aclarado mi punto de vista sobre dicha capacidad.
El comentario de Bariloche era una ironía, solo para remarcar que el avión es más versátil, nadie discute la capacidad de carga reducida, sin dudas.
Para ser más claro voy a dar un ejemplo.
Supongamos que la FAA en 1982 tenía estos avioncitos de 29Tn de carga, en vez de llevar AML-90 podríamos llevar TAM por buque. Y luego del cierre de la vía marina por parte de los ingleses hubiéramos tenido la posibilidad de reforzar enviándolos por puente aéreo.
Ahora bien, personalmente, y es opinión mía, me parece medio nabo utilizar un viaje, rompiendo bloqueo solo para llevar un tanque cuando hay muchas cosas más necesarias, pero es indiscutible que la posibilidad esta y quizás en un supuesto 21 de mayo, la ficticia fuerza de TAM’s hubiera marcado una diferencia.
Espero haber aclarado mi punto de vista sobre dicha capacidad.
S
SnAkE_OnE
a seguir leyendo
paulo
Forista Sancionado o Expulsado
Window for South Africa to join Brazilian aircraft programme is closing fast
By: Keith Campbell
12th November 2010
South Africa is rapidly running out of time to join the Embraer KC-390 military transport and air-to-air refueling aircraft programme. The KC-390 is a twin jet aircraft being designed and developed by Brazil’s highly successful and private-sector aircraft manufacturer, Embraer, under an ?initial $1,3-billion contract from the Brazilian Air Force. Embraer and Brazil are currently ?recruiting strategic partners for the programme.
“We are still in talks with Embraer. They would have liked to have a decision from us already,” reports Denel Saab Aerostructures (DSA) CEO Ismail Dockrat. “I would say that this window of opportunity will get very ?narrow by the start of December.”
A number of countries have already signaled their desire to join the programme. “The Brazilians are very keen for South African participation as well. We’ve submitted a proposal to Embraer. It’s subject to board approval and to government approval,” he states. “We are engaging government around the financial requirements and with Embraer about the technical requirements. We’re doing the best we can to bring it together.”
Embraer’s $1,3-billion contract covers the conception, design and development of the ?KC-390 and the tooling and assembly jigs needed to manufacture the aeroplane, as well as the building and certification of two prototypes. The current contract does not cover the series production of the aircraft.
The Brazilian Air Force has revealed a requirement for twenty-eight KC-390s, and five countries have so far started negotiations with Brazil to join the programme. They are (in alphabetical order) Argentina, Chile, Colombia, the Czech Republic and Portugal. Between them, these countries have stated requirements for thirty-two KC-390s, taking the total requirements to date to 60 (plus two prototypes). To meet Chile’s needs in particular, the aircraft will be designed to operate into and out of Antarctic airstrips composed of ice. In addition, Embraer is in early talks with the United Arab Emirates about the possibility of that country joining the programme.
According to the latest information, the ?KC-390 will have a wingspan of 35,06 m, a height of 10,26 m and a length of 33,81 m. In April last year, the design had had a smaller wingspan (33,94 m) and shorter length (33,43 m) ?but a greater height (11,43 m). Basically, the design has grown, and so has its capacity. At the very beginning of the project, the original KC-390 concept was intended to carry a ?maximum payload of 19 t. This was, with the redesign, increased to 23 t.
Now there are reports in Brazil – not confirmed by the company or the air force – that its maximum payload could reach 26 t or even 28 t. ?This would allow it, for example, to carry South Africa’s new infantry fighting vehicle, the 8 × 8 Badger. ?It would also mean that the KC-390 would no longer be a direct counterpart to the Lockheed Martin C-130J Super Hercules but would occupy its own niche, between the smaller C-130J and the larger Airbus Military A400M.
Meanwhile, the South African government’s recent Medium-Term Budget Policy Statement included an extra appropriation of R181,3-million for DSA. This is to cover cost overruns on the development of major components for the A400M programme, in which DSA is a partner (with responsibility for two significant work packages).
These are for the top shells (two for each aircraft) for the centre fuselage section and for the wing/fuselage fairings, manufactured mainly from composite materials but including aluminum parts. These work packages require the detailed design, development and engineering of the components (and of the tooling needed to make these components) by the South African company, as well as their subsequent manufacture.
“We met the technical requirements but the cost exceeded expectations,” explains Dockrat. “The excess costs for the development work on the wing/fuselage fairings and the fuselage top shells had to be covered by our main shareholder – the government.” DSA is 80%-owned by State-owned defence industrial group Denel, with the other 20% being in the hands of Swedish aerospace group Saab.
Edited by: Martin Zhuwakinyu
By: Keith Campbell
12th November 2010
South Africa is rapidly running out of time to join the Embraer KC-390 military transport and air-to-air refueling aircraft programme. The KC-390 is a twin jet aircraft being designed and developed by Brazil’s highly successful and private-sector aircraft manufacturer, Embraer, under an ?initial $1,3-billion contract from the Brazilian Air Force. Embraer and Brazil are currently ?recruiting strategic partners for the programme.
“We are still in talks with Embraer. They would have liked to have a decision from us already,” reports Denel Saab Aerostructures (DSA) CEO Ismail Dockrat. “I would say that this window of opportunity will get very ?narrow by the start of December.”
A number of countries have already signaled their desire to join the programme. “The Brazilians are very keen for South African participation as well. We’ve submitted a proposal to Embraer. It’s subject to board approval and to government approval,” he states. “We are engaging government around the financial requirements and with Embraer about the technical requirements. We’re doing the best we can to bring it together.”
Embraer’s $1,3-billion contract covers the conception, design and development of the ?KC-390 and the tooling and assembly jigs needed to manufacture the aeroplane, as well as the building and certification of two prototypes. The current contract does not cover the series production of the aircraft.
The Brazilian Air Force has revealed a requirement for twenty-eight KC-390s, and five countries have so far started negotiations with Brazil to join the programme. They are (in alphabetical order) Argentina, Chile, Colombia, the Czech Republic and Portugal. Between them, these countries have stated requirements for thirty-two KC-390s, taking the total requirements to date to 60 (plus two prototypes). To meet Chile’s needs in particular, the aircraft will be designed to operate into and out of Antarctic airstrips composed of ice. In addition, Embraer is in early talks with the United Arab Emirates about the possibility of that country joining the programme.
According to the latest information, the ?KC-390 will have a wingspan of 35,06 m, a height of 10,26 m and a length of 33,81 m. In April last year, the design had had a smaller wingspan (33,94 m) and shorter length (33,43 m) ?but a greater height (11,43 m). Basically, the design has grown, and so has its capacity. At the very beginning of the project, the original KC-390 concept was intended to carry a ?maximum payload of 19 t. This was, with the redesign, increased to 23 t.
Now there are reports in Brazil – not confirmed by the company or the air force – that its maximum payload could reach 26 t or even 28 t. ?This would allow it, for example, to carry South Africa’s new infantry fighting vehicle, the 8 × 8 Badger. ?It would also mean that the KC-390 would no longer be a direct counterpart to the Lockheed Martin C-130J Super Hercules but would occupy its own niche, between the smaller C-130J and the larger Airbus Military A400M.
Meanwhile, the South African government’s recent Medium-Term Budget Policy Statement included an extra appropriation of R181,3-million for DSA. This is to cover cost overruns on the development of major components for the A400M programme, in which DSA is a partner (with responsibility for two significant work packages).
These are for the top shells (two for each aircraft) for the centre fuselage section and for the wing/fuselage fairings, manufactured mainly from composite materials but including aluminum parts. These work packages require the detailed design, development and engineering of the components (and of the tooling needed to make these components) by the South African company, as well as their subsequent manufacture.
“We met the technical requirements but the cost exceeded expectations,” explains Dockrat. “The excess costs for the development work on the wing/fuselage fairings and the fuselage top shells had to be covered by our main shareholder – the government.” DSA is 80%-owned by State-owned defence industrial group Denel, with the other 20% being in the hands of Swedish aerospace group Saab.
Edited by: Martin Zhuwakinyu
paulo
Forista Sancionado o Expulsado
IAI espera participar do programa KC-390
A empresa Israel Aerospace Industries (IAI) ofereceu seus sistemas para uma possível integração no desenvolvimento do avião de trasnporte/reabastecimento da Embraer, o KC-390, informou o site Global Security.
A IAI não formulou uma lista de quais equipamentos ela propôs, mas é provável que tenha incluído aviônicos para o cockpit da aeronave e sistemas de proteção.
O desenvolvimento tem por base um acordo assinado entre as duas empreasas em 2009, sob a qual se comprometeram a aumentar a cooperação através da brasleira EAE.
O acordo inclui VANTs, radares multi-missão, sistemas de navegação inercial, plataformas marítimas, entre outros. Ele também abrange serviços de atualização e conversão de aeronaves civis e militares.
A IAI já está fornecendo sistemas de radar para a modernização dos aviões de ataque A-4 da Marinha Brasileira. A empresa israelense também realiza o “overhal” dos motores deles.
Algumas fontes informaram que a Embraer também oferecerá aeronaves para missões especiais equipadas com eletrônica ou sistemas de alerta aéreo antecipado produzido pela empresa israelense. A empresa é subsidiária Elta Systems e já desenvolveu variações de vigilância do jato Gulfstream G550.
FONTE: Flight Global
A empresa Israel Aerospace Industries (IAI) ofereceu seus sistemas para uma possível integração no desenvolvimento do avião de trasnporte/reabastecimento da Embraer, o KC-390, informou o site Global Security.
A IAI não formulou uma lista de quais equipamentos ela propôs, mas é provável que tenha incluído aviônicos para o cockpit da aeronave e sistemas de proteção.
O desenvolvimento tem por base um acordo assinado entre as duas empreasas em 2009, sob a qual se comprometeram a aumentar a cooperação através da brasleira EAE.
O acordo inclui VANTs, radares multi-missão, sistemas de navegação inercial, plataformas marítimas, entre outros. Ele também abrange serviços de atualização e conversão de aeronaves civis e militares.
A IAI já está fornecendo sistemas de radar para a modernização dos aviões de ataque A-4 da Marinha Brasileira. A empresa israelense também realiza o “overhal” dos motores deles.
Algumas fontes informaram que a Embraer também oferecerá aeronaves para missões especiais equipadas com eletrônica ou sistemas de alerta aéreo antecipado produzido pela empresa israelense. A empresa é subsidiária Elta Systems e já desenvolveu variações de vigilância do jato Gulfstream G550.
FONTE: Flight Global
paulo
Forista Sancionado o Expulsado
Asi espero......e oxala se concrete.
Saludos
PD: Interesante la associacion para sitemas AWCSs:yonofui:
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